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protest planned at Harlows

Posted by flip 
flip
protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 09:52AM
[www.csus.edu]

heard this on the news this morning....................sorry no live link skills
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 10:14AM
I heard that as well this morning. I still plan on attending, mainly for Cocoa Tea. Think they will cancell?
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 10:16AM
no.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 10:20AM
Although I don't agree with all of Capelton's lyrics I also believe in the freedom of speech. An interesting tid bit from the ACLU:

Free speech rights are indivisible. Restricting the speech of one group or individual jeopardizes everyone's rights because the same laws or regulations used to silence bigots can be used to silence you. Conversely, laws that defend free speech for bigots can be used to defend the rights of civil rights workers, anti-war protesters, lesbian and gay activists and others fighting for justice. For example, in the 1949 case of Terminiello v. Chicago, the ACLU successfully defended an ex-Catholic priest who had delivered a racist and anti-semitic speech. The precedent set in that case became the basis for the ACLU's successful defense of civil rights demonstrators in the 1960s and '70s.
The indivisibility principle was also illustrated in the case of Neo-Nazis whose right to march in Skokie, Illinois in 1979 was successfully defended by the ACLU. At the time, then ACLU Executive Director Aryeh Neier, whose relatives died in Hitler's concentration camps during World War II, commented: "Keeping a few Nazis off the streets of Skokie will serve Jews poorly if it means that the freedoms to speak, publish or assemble any place in the United States are thereby weakened."
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 10:34AM
harlows is not a public gathering place. it is privately owned and they can do as they wish, allow them to play or not. does not infringe on capeltons right to rant and rave about gays. only infringes on capeltons right to rant and rave at harlows. personally i don't think he should advocate gay violence but on the other hand i will go see him if he plays (mainly to see cocoa tea and culture). however if it is cancelled i will accept it and not bitch about it.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 10:39AM
Bitching about it won't change the outcome anyway.

I have learned that a long time ago.

I just don't like all of the controversy.

I just want to enjoy my weekend. I work really hard during the week and my weekends are very special to me. I try to have the best time that I can during the weekends.

I can't stand it when I make plans and something happens to mess them up. I am still going to go, I just hope that I don't have to see any conflict. I hate conflict.



Post Edited (10-01-04 10:40)

Awakening
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 11:17AM
at the very least you will get to meet some extremely interesting people at raven.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 11:26AM
I hope so.



Awakening
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 12:04PM
wow! i hope that we can all learn to respect eachothers views

Love
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 12:11PM
oh great. what a load...

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 12:16PM
I agree Empress.

If people just worried about thier own self and if what they are doing right and stopped worrying about what someone else is doing and how they are living thier life, the world would be so much better.

We could all just love eachother as we are and be happy.

I DON'T LIKE CONFLICT.

I relly don't



Awakening
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 12:16PM
>i* hope dey come to AZ. show to protest wed.oct.6th in scottsdale so iNi can laugh in their face az dem waste more of their time trying to infringe on iNi. already checked in with promoter on both sides of dis gig & it's diffentley confirmed solid. set to burn more fya!
-RASpects+
Acacia
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 01:09PM
Huh. You hope they do come so you can laugh in their face? I always hear you talking up positivity. When does it apply to you? Why don't you just stay satisfied that it is "deffinately confirmed solid" and leave it at that? You don't need to laugh in their face. Be bigger than that.
irie-sis
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 02:35PM
well i guess thier protesting worked again i had sent harlows a email of support for this show and got this in response...Sorry but Capleton has been cancelled. The negative e-mails were outnumbering the positives 30-1. We had to do what the public wanted. Culture will still be performing. The cover charge for Culture is $20
jjlab3
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 02:44PM
What about Coco Tea?
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 02:49PM
same as with ritp...if capleton aint gonna be there then coco tea isnt either.

what a burn.

"what the public wanted". what a joke. do what the PAYING public wants you dolts. those would be people paying to come to the show, not some anonymous "public" sending 50 emails under different names from the same guy.

sheesh. time to go to jamaica.

one love
jah bill
jjlab3
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 02:58PM
Damn!!!!!!

Just Culture. I already paid $28 for tickets. I am getting my money back.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:07PM
because it will be on a saturday and i already paid my $27.50 i will still go. i hope i get some kind of refund back.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:12PM
oh and jahbill - on the harlot web site there is a banner that says "reggae legend coco tea". so no cocoa tea but coco tea??? and tho i said i wouldn't bitch about it i am dissapointed. sure wanted to see cocoa tea. now i suppose they will fill the bill with some local yokel bands.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:29PM
How come it still says Coco Tea on the website?



Awakening
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:35PM
Well at least that solves the arguement I was having with my wife about going to the show after Reggae In The Park. This is just too much!!!!! Check out Groundation at Ashkenaz instead.


fourtwentyplenty
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:41PM
Maybe we should all put our money together and invite Capleton and Cocoa to perform in someones' backyard JA style. I'd pay for that!!!! Where's that spot off the highway again Bill? Maybe MAD PLANET can get them to come to his party?


fourtwentyplenty
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:41PM
awakening: probably because they dont know which end is up and figure what the hell we can cancel capleton but this coco coffee guy will still come. but i believe the band already said: no capleton, no band, which means no coco tea. and i would think that would apply at little harlows as well as at golden gate park.

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:43PM
Just checked the Harlows site and Cocoa is off now. Also sent them a pretty viscious e-mail expressing my dissatisfaction and unwillingness to support them again.


fourtwentyplenty
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:45PM
thats not a bad idea fourtwenty, i got a big back yard! and i will supply the rocks to throw at any protestors in my neighborhood.

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:49PM
Well if they're going to be around, why not? Do you have any sense of what they get paid to do a show? I'll bring the condoms filled with rubbing alcohol to throw.


fourtwentyplenty
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:50PM
I'll put some in on it!!!

I just got paid. lol!



Awakening
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:52PM
a) they wont be around. why would they come to provincial sacto especially after a "welcome" like this?

b) how much? more than you would be willing to pay

c) ive got a pretty big stereo but its not going to be adequate.

d) i know a certain ranch out in ryde though...hint hint

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:57PM
How much Bill? Just curious.

fourtwentyplenty
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 03:59PM
how do i know fourtwenty? i suppose you would want to ask robbie at renegade or the tours management.

as an aside i just looked at the biltmore web site. i dont know if they were mentioned there before but i dont see anything about the show now.

oh well. theres always reggae in the park. not.

one love
jah bill
jjlab3
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:00PM
I'll throw in on it.

Call your Ryde contacts.

Oh wait, I think I have been there. Lot's of trees, right?

That would be a great place.
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:02PM
ps: i would guess 8 to 10 grand for the band, and both vocalists and revue. just a guess. that includes nothing else, no equipment, no lights, no room. and of course you would have to accomodate the entertainers in the fashion they have become accustomed to. add another grand for that, at least.

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:03PM
How do you know? You know everything!!! Remember you're the reggae librarian? HAHA!!! Well I figured since you've been financially involved in the festival scene and have had personal dubplates made for you that you'd be the best one around here to ask.


fourtwentyplenty
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:04PM
might even lower that to 5 grand. still a lot of money.

one love
jah bill
obsessing...
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:05PM
>personal dubplates made for you

never paid for them though.

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:06PM
I can put up money for the hos in case Capleton reverts back to his pre-Rasta slack days.


fourtwentyplenty
jjlab3
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:21PM
If those are the prices how could promoter make any money at a place like Harlow's? . What is their capapcity? 300-500.

I think Capeltons's price has come way down with all of these protests.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:30PM
drinks jjlab3...drinks. at 5bucks a shot they rack up a lot of drink money.
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:35PM
you cant just count money in at the door as the sole income or rationale for a promoter like renegade. they probably make a bit at the bar, and they make up losses on these kinds of shows by putting on their jamband shows that draw big crowds. but that was my question from the beginning of this...how is anyone going to make any money with culture and these guys too. answer is: probably no one will but the artists. i believe this tours going price a year or so ago was more than 10k$ just for capleton coco tea and the revue with band. maybe they make concessions to smaller places as pick up dates for days between their big shows, which seem to all get cancelled.

thats one reason i thought this would be a fiasco from the time they cancelled at golden gate park. the writing was on the wall though it got a bit obscured by this renegade business.

one love
jah bill
jjlab3
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 04:45PM
I understand about drinks.

I fiugred Harlow's kept the Bar Revenue and may got a small piece of the door. I fiugred Renegade made most of their money at the door and maybe a small portion of the bar.

Still even if Capleton and Coc lowered the fee to $5000 and Culture as a headliner got 5 k they would have to sell over 400 tickets to even make $1200.

Having worked for SNWMF for a few years I always tried to estimate how much profit they made.

It was all conjecture on my part but it seems as if the promoting business is real lean.

Oh well I guess the point is moot.
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 01, 2004 05:17PM
>seems as if the promoting business is real lean.

i think the reggae promoting business is real lean. you didnt even figure in the costs of advertising and associated stuff. successful promoters vary the type of shows they promote and make back on the successful ones what they lose on the not so successful ones.

thats my conjecture anyway. dont know how else they could stay in business.

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 12:45AM
Theres gonna be a protest at the Catalyst show on sunday. I read that the organizer said, "How can I not protest when someones talking about killing me?'
And then this morning on 88.1, they were talking about how the Catalyst should cancel Capleton, and that he advocated violence toward gays. And that's the reason got dropped from Golden Gate Park.

Is he really that bad or do people just misunderstand>?
I'm just glad that the catalyst is not cancelling(so they say). that place might be good for sometimeg afterall.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 03:11AM
oh my goodnes.. so whats going on? i think i may just stay home.. reggae in the park.. notjhing.. Culture.. hmmmm
Love
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 02:26PM
acacia> im already laughing & the show has not even started yet. burn dem batty & lizbo'z! -RASpects+
jbwelda
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 03:56PM
in the suckto bee today there was a pretty large article about the cancelling at harlows. once again this is like the ONLY mention of reggae here aside from an occasional mention when one of the marleys is around.

but they quoted the owner of the catalyst as saying he would definately not cancel the show. "theres still something called freedom of speech" was his statement i think.

meanwhile robbie claims he "didnt know" about capleton or his lyrics (as quoted in the article). thats so weak. maybe he should have made a stand despite the club itself cancelling the show. or at least not bow down so easily. i think its pathetic. and i wonder if the biltmore show went on...if so, how come he didnt cancel that if he was so upset to find out what kinda thing capleton rails about...

and the article purely blew the thing out of all proportion too...like capleton stands on stage and demands the audience go find some gays and burn them literally.

its all so weak. next thing you know someone will be complaining about rastas smoking and that will be the end of it. or that they want to "kill" the pope or our illustrious president. these people should stick to innoculous jamband stuff rather than "message" music. all together now, lets limbo!

one love
jah bill
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 04:08PM
Damn straight Bill. But once again, if the artists won't stand up for themselves, this will keep happening.
How long ago was it Buju last recorded Boom Bye Bye (and apologized)?
flip
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 08:50PM
i can't believe they cancelled Capleton and Coco T...

Biltmore show went on sort of as scheduled. Coco T started playing at around 11pm. pretty much played the same set he played at Sierra Nevada 03. great set. rikers island, one drop, she loves me now...i can't remember all the tunes it was a long night. never a big fan of reggae shows at casino's. drooling, 1970 haircut, 3rd rate security stopping people from smoking. anyway...Coco T played for about an hour...
short break- out comes Capleton. personally I was not a big fan. I saw him at SNWMF and was not into it. this time I thought he was really good. came out with tons of energy. the band played some vintage roots rythmns (for about 10 seconds) then he would break into mayhem.
half hour break followed by Culture. Culture ran thru a familiar set with a few added tunes. it was about 3:30 when they stopped playing.

no protesters of any kind. no controversey that i saw. only drooling, perm wearing security guards looking for ganja smokers

Capleton didn't do any slackness that i heard. did mention something about equal rights for everyone.......once he gets going though I can't say i understand every word. which is what is so lame about the whole thing. if you were one of these people who are so upset and you were at a Capleton show you probably wouldn't understand if he was singing anti-gay lyrics or not. how could you be so offended? like these people are big dancehall fans?
Selecta
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 02, 2004 09:13PM
sounds like fun but capleton is known for switching between slackness and culture sounds at his shows. Its up to him as far as im concerned...I have mixed feelings about his shows because of his constant screaming and persitstant passing of the mic to the crowd. Coco Tea is MUCH better live and is the only reason i went to the show last time they came through. Much respect to him for his performance.
BMC
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 03, 2004 02:58AM
I'm afraid the cancelling of these Capleton shows are also just the beginning for you guys over there, just as they started with cancelling Buju and Beenie over here and now do / try the same with Vybz Kartel, Sizzla, Elephant Man etc, leading to cancellation of an entire festival in the UK because no place could be found where they'd allow a show like that. Media starts reporting and the issue becomes widely known, leading to more and more cancellations and a stop of booking 'involved' artists of the 'wanted'-list from gay-rights group Outrage from the UK (the 8 are: Elephant Man, TOK, Beenie Man, Sizzla, Vybz Kartel, Capleton, Buju Banton, Bounty Killer).

It'll probably blow over after a while, but here in Europe the publicity around it resulted in more than half of the Buju Banton tour this year being cancelled by the venues (gald enough I did see him in Amsterdam!!).
Papa Ranking
Big deal
October 03, 2004 05:44AM
these guys are rubbish,vybz,elephant,buju,tok,capleton,bounty,sizzla lost the plot years ago,its funny hearing these guys desperate statements$$$$,they havent even got the courage of their convictions,move on check true roots music
BMC
So what is true roots music?
October 03, 2004 06:53AM
Ah, there's another one of the 'if-it's-not-roots-it's-rubbish-clan'.

"its funny hearing these guys desperate statements$$$$"

Examples, please?
Selecta
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 03, 2004 07:04AM
"if its not roots its rubbish clan" nice one...I have not been to a dance in years that didnt play the mentioned artists.
Papa Ranking
Re: Big deal
October 03, 2004 07:29AM
Didnt say "if its not roots its rubbish" some of their pathetic statements have been quoted on previous threads,cant wait to see who goes for career suicide first (a duet with elton john)
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 03, 2004 02:00PM
>1 up on papa ranking* -RASpects+
BMC
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 03, 2004 02:22PM
P.R.:
No, you didn't say it literally, but what else did you mean with "move on check true roots music" then?

If you like roots music better, fine, so do I, but if you don't like a certain style of music, it doesn't mean it's all rubbish. There's plenty of rubbish released in JA every month, but also quite some bashment / ragga that is very enjoyable and without useless statements.

"..cant wait to see who goes for career suicide first (a duet with elton john)"

Beenie Man already appeared on the show of Ru Paul or whatever the name is. Does that count?
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 03, 2004 08:14PM
Well they officially cancelled tonights show at the Catalyst, "Due to public outcry and safety concerns." I've never hated gays so much in my life. (JK).
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 03, 2004 09:33PM
As far as i know Capleton was not at the gay marriage the other day protesting!
this is rediculous,,... reachig out to everyone who has media ties
we have to fight back and get it out there that not everyone agress with this!!
what about freedom of speech!
the whole friggin tour got cancellllled! now i have to fly to NY to see a show!
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 10:11AM
don't hate the symptom rastacruz, hate the cause (capelton singing about bashing gays).
Selecta
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 10:14AM
the cause is liberal do gooders in california trying to make sure no one ever gets offended. If you dont like it dont listen to it and dont go to the shows. sadly it looks like capletons carrer has gone the same way as Shaba Ranks did when he was on British TV and slammed the batty man.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 10:32AM
too bad. don't preach discrimination and violence.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 10:40AM
If every one could just love and accept everyone as they are, none of this would be happening.

I did go Saturday night, but I didn't stay. I felt very disappointed.



Awakening
Selecta
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 10:52AM
If the world could just all think the same and no one ever said anyhting to make anyone mad and if all weapons were destroyed the world would be a better place...but its not so lets try and put restrictions on what people say in their music and in every public forum.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 11:27AM
how can U come by the name "Selecta" and not speak on behalf of the music. Freedom of Speech hater. U know what U need. More Capleton. More Sizzla. More Sizzla pon the radio. More CCCCCCCAAApleton on the radio. Remind to never come to one of your gigs. STAY POSITVE

POSITIVE VIBRATION PROTEST

Sorry but me bubbling hot right now. Red, Red, Red, HOT
Selecta
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 11:41AM
I was being sarcastic you crazy fool!!!!! Read my other posts and you will understand.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 11:44AM
Respect da selecta
I hear U now. I overstand. FREEDOM OF SPEECH. And sometimes we take ourselves to seriously. MORE FIRE.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 11:49AM
capelton and others have their freedom of speech. they just don't have the freedom to speech whereever they choose. not the same thing. settle down. it is of their own doing.
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 04, 2004 01:18PM
NO regay, just reggae. im sure sumtime u will overstand. >1LUV*+*+*+*+*+*+*+
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 06, 2004 12:48PM
Say what you want to say just don't take the music away. SIZZLA has about 1000 songs if 5 of them are anti-gay. Then that's only .5%
Re: protest planned at Harlows
October 06, 2004 02:09PM
And if only 5 of them are any good, that's the same .5%
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